Combs Waterkotte, Missouri’s Leading Traffic Lawyers and DWI/DUI Defense Attorneys, sit down to discuss the ins and outs of traffic tickets in Missouri, including speeding, DWI/DUIs, collateral consequences, and how a lawyer can defend you against charges associated with these tickets. With over 10,000 cases handled, Combs Waterkotte is very knowledgeable about all things Missouri traffic.
Episode Transcript
Scott Michael Dunn: Welcome back to Hexxen Studios. We’ve got back in the studio Chris Combs and Andrew Russek. Combs Waterkotte is the leading defense firm practicing in both Illinois and Missouri. Today, we’re going to talk about traffic law. Chris, what kind of experience does Combs Waterkotte have in traffic law?
Chris Combs: We actually do a very high volume of traffic, tickets. We go statewide to handle traffic tickets, and we do a great job for our clients. You know, we’re able to keep points off of people’s licenses, keep insurance rates down, and things like that.
Combs Waterkotte handles thousands of traffic tickets a year. We’re very high volume on the traffic tickets.
Scott Michael Dunn: Wow, that’s a lot of tickets.
Chris Combs: It is.
Scott Michael Dunn: Well, let’s go to the basics. Andrew, can you, can you explain what is a traffic citation? Is it different than a ticket? Or what does it mean to have a traffic citation?
Andrew Russek: So, a traffic citation would be speeding, of various different degrees. And, it can be as high as – some people may qualify DUIs or careless and imprudent, which are tickets that have jail time on them. Careless and imprudent could have up to a year in jail.
So they can vary in how serious they are. They’re normally handled in municipal court, which I would say is the biggest distinction, as opposed to state court.
Scott Michael Dunn: What types of traffic violations do you generally work with, Chris?
Chris Combs: So again, as Andrew had said, there’s a wide range of violations that fall under traffic; as high as a first offense, DWI, which is a B misdemeanor, all the way down to your, you know, 11 to 15 over speeding. So we see it all. There’s nothing we haven’t seen traffic-wise.
And again, there’s varying degrees, as Andrew said. You go all the way from a DWI to a basic ticket and everything in between, and we see it all.
Scott Michael Dunn: Where do I find my traffic ticket online in Missouri?
Andrew Russek: So Missouri CaseNet (courts.mo.gov) has all cases. It’s an open docket system, so murders all the way down to your failure to obey a traffic signal. You should be able to find it on there.
Sometimes you do need an attorney’s assistance, especially if you’re in a smaller municipality or more rural community. So that’s what we help people with a lot, just locating the information on their ticket, let alone helping them in court with it.
Chris Combs: And I think a big thing that people who haven’t really had any experience with the law have a tough time – and it is kind of confusing – that you could be ticketed this morning, however, you haven’t been charged with speeding.
That ticket has to go to a prosecutor. Prosecutor has to sign it, and then give it to a court clerk and issue it. So we get people that hire us for a speeding ticket they got two days ago, and the statute of limitations is a year. So we have to run their name through various systems every day, because it could be three weeks until it’s issued, or three months.
So that’s another thing that we have to keep an eye on when people hire us on traffic tickets.
Scott Michael Dunn: Well, let’s get into what it takes to hire a traffic lawyer. Well, first of all, what does a traffic lawyer do?
Chris Combs: So it’s – I can’t say this enough, it is so critical to always get an attorney for a traffic ticket. It is.
A lot of times, police officers don’t do you any favors. They’ll just say, “Hey, this is no big deal. You know, the fine’s on the back, you mail it in and…” Well, that’s pleading guilty, and that’s taking the points. So, traffic lawyers are not terribly expensive, and to keep your driving record clean, why would you not?
Because you’re going to see those costs and increased insurance premiums. So hiring a traffic lawyer is a complete no-brainer.
Scott Michael Dunn: Do I need – Andrew, do I need a lawyer to contest a ticket?
Andrew Russek: I think, as Chris said, it’s a no-brainer that you would want an attorney. Technically, you could go to court yourself and attempt to contest it, but it’s your word versus a police officer that that judge sees every day, every night in court.
So in order to get discovery, to understand the system, to have access to different databases, understand the statutes and what’s necessary to actually have you found guilty, a lawyer can be extremely helpful.
Even if you think it’s a relatively small ticket, it can have pretty serious collateral consequences. And the judge doesn’t have to tell you that if you try and represent yourself. So you may not even know what you’re getting into.
Scott Michael Dunn: Yeah, and that kind of boils down to the why. The why – why should I hire a traffic lawyer?
Andrew Russek: Tickets can have a lot of consequences. Even smaller speedings, 11 to 15, that’s going to A. Put points on your license, and it’s technically a criminal conviction once you start getting a little bit higher in speeding. They are C misdemeanors, B misdemeanors, and even some traffic tickets are A misdemeanors, which is equivalent to assault.
So not only may you end up with something on your criminal record without understanding it, you may put points on your license, which could result in a license suspension. Your insurance premiums are going to go up, and those kinds of things.
Again, a judge doesn’t have to tell you that. He’s going to tell you it’s a $250 fine, which sounds great in the moment, and then six months down the road, you get another ticket, and your license is suspended.
Scott Michael Dunn: It seems like costs just keep going up.
Andrew Russek: They can, or the other consequences on top of it.
Scott Michael Dunn: Well, speaking of being in front of a judge, well, let’s talk about pleas and fighting a traffic ticket.
Should I fight the ticket or just pay it?
Chris Combs: Well, obviously, as I mentioned earlier, you never want to just pay a traffic ticket, because that’s pleading guilty. So again, if you just pay the fine and mail it in, you’re entering a plea of guilt to speeding, and you’re taking the points.
So, as far as fighting a traffic ticket: You know, we don’t have jury trials on traffic tickets. I mean, most people don’t want to pay to have us depose an officer and break down all the data of whatever radar he was using. But there’s so many things we can do to get it down to a non-moving, no-point violation, to where you can – you will still pay a fine, but there’s no other collateral consequences.
Scott Michael Dunn: So, can you get into more detail about whether or not I should just pay the ticket or should I fight it? I mean, is there differentiating between when is the right time to do that?
Chris Combs: Well, you always want to “fight it,” because again, if you just pay it, your entering a plea of guilt. And as Andrew said, you could be entering a plea of guilt to a misdemeanor.
I mean, it doesn’t mean you’re going to jail, but that creates points on your driving record that are likely going to be on there for quite some time – many, many years. And a criminal conviction. Even though it’s traffic, you may not know it’s a B misdemeanor.
Anytime in Missouri you’re going 26 miles or more over the speed limit, that’s a B misdemeanor, that’s the same level offense as a first offense DWI.
Scott Michael Dunn: Wow.
Chris Combs: It’s serious. So if you’re going 26 or more, that’s a B misdemeanor, and you’d be, in my opinion, foolish not to have an attorney guiding you through that and to keep points off your record and a conviction off your criminal record.
Scott Michael Dunn: So what happens if I plead not guilty to a traffic violation?
Andrew Russek: It’d be like pleading [not guilty] to any case. Then you get new court dates, and you have an opportunity to fight the case. Some traffic tickets may even have discovery, like a DUI or careless and imprudent, there may be a police report to review.
You may want to challenge the calibration of the radar that the officer used to clock your speed. You may want to get a copy of his dashboard camera because all those things could create defenses just like you would see in a murder or an assault case. So not guilty would give you those new court dates and give you the opportunity to get an attorney and fight those.
Even if you plead not guilty. There’s no reason not to at first, just to make sure that you explore all your options, whether it’s an attorney or what that attorney can do for you. And you obviously, well, yeah.
Scott Michael Dunn: So what happens if I just pay the ticket? Does that work the same?
Andrew Russek: So as, as Chris has been saying, paying the ticket, whether you do it online or you go to court and the judge tells you something that sounds really nice, you are pleading guilty. Paying that fine is the equivalent of a guilty plea, which means that you are admitting to whatever you’re charged with, you’re accepting those consequences, and you are putting that on your record.
Scott Michael Dunn: So what happens if the police officer’s wrong about the ticket?
Chris Combs: You know, you don’t see that terribly often. I mean, here’s the thing: It’s just simply that we’re able to avoid points and get most traffic tickets down to a non-moving, no-point violation. So there is no criminal conviction. There are no points on your driving record.
So you don’t see a lot of us breaking down radar, data analysis, and things like that. Now I have – I’ve had CDL drivers where a traffic ticket could destroy their insurance rates. I mean, to where it’s not even worth being a CDL driver because they have to carry those multimillion-dollar commercial policies.
So I have fought them before and taken them to trial, but that’s rare. Typically, we are able to work something out on our client’s behalf that they’re happy with. That avoids both points on your license and a criminal conviction.
Scott Michael Dunn: Well, relating that, so how do you get out of a traffic ticket?
Chris Combs: There’s multiple different ways. A lot of times, it’s our relationships with prosecutors and things like that. If your driving record’s clean, that’s important. Now, if I show up with a driving record where you just paid the fine three times, you’ve got three convictions on there, that’s going to be a little bit harder to work with.
That’s when we have our clients get into mitigation. Sometimes we’ll have them do driving school, in-person driving school. With these higher speed tickets that are classified as B misdemeanors, we’ll have them do a two-hour online class called Victim Impact Panel.
A lot of people think it’s just for drunk driving – it’s Mothers Against Drunk Driving – but it talks about people who’ve lost loved ones to both DWI, accidents, and high-speed crashes. So mitigation can be important. Community service, things like that. You always want to do everything you can to keep points off your driving record.
Scott Michael Dunn: Now, Andrew, can a traffic ticket be dismissed?
Andrew Russek: A traffic ticket can be dismissed.
Scott Michael Dunn: Well, how would you go about doing that?
Andrew Russek: A couple different ways: As Chris was kind of saying sometimes, if there’s not much of a factual defense, but we’re able to work out a good deal, that deal may be the traffic ticket is dismissed.
Or, if you have a couple of traffic tickets, we can get some of the more serious ones dismissed. You pay a fine on the other ones.
Sometimes we are able to show that the case should be dismissed just because you did everything you needed to do, and a fine’s not necessary. So there’s a couple different reasons. Just like any criminal case, a traffic ticket could ultimately be dismissed
Scott Michael Dunn: I’m not a traffic attorney, but I know there’s ways to appeal a traffic ticket. Well, how do you appeal a traffic violation?
Andrew Russek: The most common appeal we see is people who plead guilty without understanding those collateral consequences. Next day, they realize their insurance calls them and says, your insurance just shot up. Or they realize they have points for whatever reason.
So the most common appeal we see is these individuals who pay tickets online or go to court and just pay the fine, suddenly, and realize they have a criminal conviction. In that case, we go back in front of that same judge and argue that the [plea] wasn’t constitutionally sufficient to satisfy due process.
You can take traffic tickets to a higher level than that, although that is rare.
Chris Combs: Typically, what we do in that situation is if someone goes in and just pays the ticket, doesn’t understand what it’s going to do to their driving record, or their criminal record, is we’ll file a motion to set aside their guilty plea.
And then we go back to the drawing board. And when we file that motion to set aside that guilty plea, we explained to the judge that, look, our client had no idea what these collateral consequences were going to be. They weren’t properly advised. So we’ll get the guilty plea set aside, and then we’ll go back to work and get it down to a non-moving, no-point violation without any collateral consequences on your criminal record or driving record.
Scott Michael Dunn: Now, speaking of the court, so what is the traffic court process? What, what can I expect in a traffic court?
Chris Combs: Well, there’s two different types of traffic court. You’ve got traffic court in state court, and you have traffic court in municipal courts. So Missouri, of course, has, I think near 200 municipalities.
Chesterfield, Wildwood, Hazelwood, Jennings, Brentwood, Clayton, on and on. They all have their own courts. So it could be out of one of those jurisdictions or it could be in state court. A lot of the tickets you see in state court are issued by Missouri State Highway Patrol, that automatically means you’re going to state court.
It can be a little bit more difficult to work out cases in state court than it is in municipal court.
Scott Michael Dunn: Yeah.
Chris Combs: However, those are the two jurisdictions that you’re going to see or find yourself in, is either municipal or state.
Scott Michael Dunn: Do you have to go to court for a traffic ticket?
Chris Combs: If you hire an attorney, it’s very rare you have to go to court.
That’s another huge benefit that people don’t realize is if you go show up to traffic court – and I could show you a picture on my phone because it’s been pretty wild with the new year and all the time off. It looks like a rock concert. I mean, you’re there from 9:00 AM till noon, waiting to see a prosecutor.
For a lot of people, paying an attorney a couple hundred dollars to not only keep it off your driving record and keep it off of your criminal record and not have to go sit and wait in line at either 9:00 AM if you’re in state court, till you know, presumably noon, or a lot of these municipalities hold court at night.
So you show up at 5:30 and you don’t get home till 8:00.
Scott Michael Dunn: Man.
Chris Combs: So that’s another big benefit of hiring a lawyer. So to answer your question, the short version is: It’s very rare that you will have to make a personal appearance in court on a traffic ticket if you hire a defense lawyer.
Scott Michael Dunn: That’s relieving to hear that.
Chris Combs: Yeah.
Scott Michael Dunn: How long does traffic court take, Andrew?
Andrew Russek: As Chris was saying, if you go there by yourself, it can take hours because you’ll sit in line to either talk to the prosecutor or the judge. And some of these municipalities are at night, so same thing, you’ll be there past dinner, just waiting, watching everybody else go first, especially if your name is later in the alphabet.
So, for attorneys, we often are able to work these things out in advance because we have direct communication with the prosecutors. Or we’re able to get there early or skip the line, so it moves much quicker if you have counsel.
Scott Michael Dunn: And what happens if I miss a court date for a traffic ticket?
Andrew Russek: If you don’t have an attorney and you miss it, very serious consequences.
You could have a warrant put out for your arrest, just like you could in any other case, and you could be picked up one day, driving to work or to pick up your kids. And just like any other warrant, you could be brought down to the jail, and hopefully, you have the money to post bond on it.
Scott Michael Dunn: Let’s get into the driving record points and insurance.
Do traffic tickets go on your record?
Chris Combs: Yes. Absolutely. We’ve covered this a little bit, but again, you pay that fine, you don’t get an attorney, your run-of-the-mill ticket is two points. Some of these more serious violations can be, I mean, those high-speed tickets are three points.
Insurance companies know what these points mean. And, you know, your careless impudence and your DWIs – they can cause license revocation and suspension.
Scott Michael Dunn:Dang.
Chris Combs:So, it may seem kind of silly that we’re sitting here spending all this time on traffic tickets, but they have a lot of consequences.
[E]veryone gets traffic tickets, right? All walks of life. And a lot of people just don’t understand the collateral consequences that can come from just paying the fine and going down the road.
Scott Michael Dunn: So speaking, like, ending up on your record, how long does a traffic ticket sit on my record?
Chris Combs: So that’s a tough question to answer, and I’ll explain why. So, I’ve had a traffic ticket before, and I didn’t know what I was doing and wanted to hide it from my parents, so I just paid the fine.
Well, I pulled my own driving record and it, it fell off. And I didn’t pay any attention. But I pull driving records sometimes, because we pull driving records – the second someone calls us, we’re pulling driving records. And I’ve seen traffic tickets going back to the eighties on some people’s driving records, so there’s no general rule of thumb of when it falls off.
Scott Michael Dunn: How does the license point system work in Missouri?
Andrew Russek: So in Missouri, the general point system would be 12 points on your license in a year – if you hit that 12 point number, the way it works is you can get your license back once those points start to fall off, but they take a year to fall off. So, most of the time points add up over time. 2, 3, 4 points here or there.
Some very serious traffic cases – like leaving the scene, or other ones – can be 6 to 12 points. And if you reach that 12 point mark, your license is completely suspended. You can’t drive even if you get special insurance or any other type of modification like that. The more tickets you get, the more convictions you get to a straight ticket, the quicker it’s going to be to suspension.
Scott Michael Dunn: Now, how many points will I get? If you could go into a little more detail, like how many points do I get on my license from a traffic ticket?
Andrew Russek: Depends on the traffic ticket. Your medium speeds are 2. Your higher speeds are 3. No insurance is 4. Leaving the scene is a straight 12 points. So, leaving the scene conviction–
Scott Michael Dunn: Wow.
Andrew Russek: –you’re just suspended for a year.
Scott Michael Dunn: Wow.
Chris Combs: Same with the DWI – 12 points.
Scott Michael Dunn: Wow. How does that affect your – I mean, I know the insurance companies realize the point system – but let’s say I got 12 points. What’s going to happen? Will the traffic ticket or the points increase my insurance?
Chris Combs: Yeah. A lot of times you’ll see ’em skyrocket.
I mean, I once had a woman call me on one of those 26 miles or more that are B misdemeanors, same level as a first offense DWI, and she was a little sticker shocked by what it was going to take for us to fix that.
Scott Michael Dunn: Wow.
Chris Combs: Because they’re really, really tough. And just in the last couple years, we have seen them really crack down on these speeding tickets – jail time is associated with a first offense.
Scott Michael Dunn: Wow.
Chris Combs: If you’re going 30, 40 miles over the speed limit, which, you know, if the speed limit’s 70 and you’re going 95, 98, some people don’t pay attention. You know, you can find yourself there. And yes. Insurance companies know exactly what it is, and they’ll drop you.
And sometimes you’re required to get what’s called SR 22 insurance, which is high-risk insurance. That’s not cheap.
Scott Michael Dunn: Can traffic tickets affect my job or a CDL?
Andrew Russek: They can affect your job depending on the type of traffic ticket and what your job is. CDL especially.
So for CDL, there’s a Federal statute – called “anti-masking” is the colloquial term for it – which inherently means that certain grant money to agencies from the federal government are contingent on, for lack of a better word, them coming down harder on CDL tickets.
Scott Michael Dunn: Wow.
Andrew Russek: So they’re not supposed to, essentially, cut you a break. Right?
If you were speeding, don’t have a record, a state prosecutor may cut you a break, give you a fine. They’re not supposed to do that for CDL tickets. And CDLs are very contingent on points. So, A. your insurance is automatically more, so the increase in your insurance is going to be exponential if you’re a CDL holder, as well as you may just lose your CDL from the Department of Revenue, or whatever DMV or licensed out of, whatever state.
And I would imagine most employers don’t want their drivers having speeding tickets. So, you may also become a candidate – even if you hold onto your CDL license, you may get dropped by your commercial company that gives you business.
So, there are things we can do with certain CDL tickets, but it’s a lot more serious. It’s not just showing up to court and talking to the prosecutor one time. It takes a lot more work on those CDLs, but there’s a lot more hanging over your head if you’re a CDL driver.
Chris Combs: And I’ve had certain CDL drivers tell me, “Look, if I take these points, it doesn’t even make sense for me to be a CDL driver because my insurance rates will go up that much.”
Scott Michael Dunn: Wow.
Chris Combs: Yeah.
Scott Michael Dunn: What’s the difference maker for Combs Waterkotte? Why should somebody call you for a traffic violation?
Chris Combs: One, as I mentioned earlier, we handle such a high volume of them. Therefore, we’re in front of these judges and prosecutors all the time. They know us. They know that we know what we’re doing, which they appreciate, as opposed to someone representing themselves. Mitigation is a big thing.
I always tell clients, “Look, I’m not your dad. I don’t pay your bills. You don’t have to do this.” But if you want to avoid points, it sounds crazy, but you’re going to have to do in-person driving school. You’re going to have to do some community service. But I can tell you, you don’t want this traffic ticket following you around.
What sets us apart is we know exactly what we’re dealing with. We do a lot of them. And DWIs, those are very inherently complex cases. You’ve got the civil side with the Missouri Department of Revenue and your driving privileges, and you have your criminal charge of DWI.
There’s no way you can fight a DWI on your own. I mean, there’s just no way. You have to have a lawyer.
Scott Michael Dunn: Yeah. I mean, absolutely.
Chris Combs: And we get great results on DWIs, across the board.
Scott Michael Dunn: Absolutely. What about staying in contact? I mean, do the clients feel like you’ll stay in contact with them, let them know what’s going on, what’s next?
Chris Combs: So I always say [what] sets Combs Waterkotte, apart from almost any other firm out there is two things:
One: Communication. Lawyers are notorious for being bad about communication. We give out our cell phone numbers. You don’t get stonewalled by a receptionist or a paralegal. You can get your lawyer on the phone. People appreciate that. We are religious about staying in contact with our clients, and that is paramount. I can’t explain how many, just, nice Google reviews we get simply by just being available and communicating with people.
And second, what sets us apart, and I always say it sounds cheesy, but: We’re results-driven. And what I mean by that is we don’t just take it on the cheap, get the first deal the prosecutor offers, take it to our clients, say, “Here you go”.
We’re really fighting these things to get the absolute best result for our clients.
Scott Michael Dunn: It sounds like it takes experience, know-how, and a conscientious attitude towards your clients.
Chris Combs: Yes. And the more [of these you do] and the more you’re in front of the same judges and prosecutors, and you know what you’re doing, it definitely – there’s a craft to it.
And again, it may sound silly; we’re talking about traffic tickets. But we just talked about all the collateral consequences and how serious it can be.
Scott Michael Dunn: Long-term financial consequences.
Chris Combs: Yes.
And I didn’t finish my story earlier, but I had a woman who had a 26-mile-per-hour over, was sticker shocked, paid it, and then she called me a year later and had gotten another one, and she said, “Biggest mistake of my life not hiring you the first time.”
She goes, “I’ve paid $6,000 in increased insurance premiums in the last 18 months for pleading guilty for that high-speed ticket.”
Scott Michael Dunn: Wow. Wow. Well, I appreciate you guys coming in. This is some great and valuable information. It may seem basic to the traffic law world or the attorneys out there, but for a lot of us that sit behind the wheel, we don’t know how this stuff works.
So it’s nice to know that you guys are out there for us. We appreciate it.
Chris Combs: Yeah, thank you.
Scott Michael Dunn: You’re welcome.
Andrew Russek: Thank you for having us.
Scott Michael Dunn: We’ll see you next time on Hexxen studios.
If you’ve got a traffic ticket and want to lower your fines, avoid points, and keep your insurance premiums down, call Combs Waterkotte at (314) 900-HELP or reach out online for a free consultation.
